Talk:Bearded Collie

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Ancestry

I removed the text saying the Komondor and the OES are part of the beardies' ancestry, since there's little or no evidence to support that.;Carl

Correct to remove these as it has been proven that Beardies are not related to either. In fact the Beardie is free from the MDR1 gene which the OES carries - clear proof they are not related. I don't believe the Komondor is MDR1 but if you go back to www.bcpedigree.se website you can track almost every beardie breed since WW2 After going back over the structure and size of the Komondor I would have to say it would have been an unlikely candidate for a hybridization with a Beardie. Back "in the old days" stud masters, who were generally horse, sheep or cattle men with a long history of breeding animals, would have been consulted to determine a best match. If you look at the old stud master histories they generally relied on phenotypical matches (phenotype being the visible manifestation of genetic coding as opposed to genetype which is the genetic coding its'self). The Komondor is a poor phenotype match as it's size is almost twice that of the Beardie. It takes a long time, and a lot of work to hybridise phenotypical mis-matches. With 1 allele from each parent you will always have divergence from the preferred phenotype so you need to only be breeding from those animals which exhibit the preferred phenotype and even then you will not be guaranteed of the preferred phenotype in any litter. Essentially breeding from phenotypical mis-matches could theoretically result in an animal in which one half looks like one breed and the other half likes like the other. Using phenotypically similar animals reduces the divergence or variance in the litters. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 58.170.211.12 (talk) 11:16, 11 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for telling us that brilliant news User:CyBorg. That will help us a lot.

Thanks a lot!!! Rm200661

Names

This looks like a mistake: "Hairy Mou ed Collie" ;Bear 20:01, 2004 Oct 23 (UTC)

It's not. It's a really old term for "hairy-mouthed Collie." You were right to add it -- it is an old name for the Beardie. --my3seadogs 18:44, 2 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Lots of people say that Wikipedia is incorrect. Please feel free to give your thoughts on what Wikipedia is like. It has been a very good fact website, but now I realize that maybe the Wiki isn't trustworthy on the facts.

Thanks! Rm200661

Help!

Did a bit of editing on this page as it was a bit bare. Going to do some research tonight on general health concerns, and also adding a few pictures of my own. Any Beardie people, please feel free to contribute! -- User:iiartisanii 14/march/07

I added some information from the site :www.dog-dna.com/breeds/Bearded-Collie.php

I added about weight and height, but feel free to change it as that was the only site I could find with that information, so it may be wrong. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Misty7737 (talk • contribs) 17:00, 9 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I am doing a dog project and I am on Bearded Collie. Do you think I should go to a different website just for this one and come back when I am on the next dog or do you think I should wait till it is fixed? please get back to me soon!

Thanks! Rm200661

Hi! Its me Rm200661 again. I would be glad to help fixing the page. I just got an account a few months ago so pleas tell me what to do it you want me to help! Please get back to me if you have an idea, feel free to tell me and I will tell the leader of the process of fixing the page.

Thanks for your help again! Rm200661

Hi Guys! It's me Rm200661 again! We don't know if the websites we are getting the "right" facts from are actually right so if you want to list some of the websites that you have been looking on, feel free to do that and I could check them out and see if they are trustworthy. if you think my idea is stupid, I'm sorry I was just giving a suggestion because we could be giving the wrong information

If you don't like my idea, just say "I don't think we should do that" instead of "That's SO stupid!!! You are the dumbest person I have ever met!!" because that would hurt their feelings.

Thanks a lot! From, Rm200661 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rm200661 (talk • contribs) 01:24, 27 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]

History, etc.

Tried to make this section more encyclopedic and removed the "story" tag. As a copy editor with only a general knowledge of dogs, I don't understand this sentence at the end of the "Working Life" section:

"Very few beardies show "eye" when working, most are quite upright".

...so any clarification would be welcome. Wi2g 23:33, 14 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Those herding dogs which "show eye" are generally those which crouch and/or slink and maintain eye contact with stock in an effort to predict direction of movement. Those which herd upright - stand upright. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 202.6.151.127 (talk) 07:05, 11 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Assessment comment

The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:Bearded Collie/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.

The books about Beardies section should be entirely deleted, it's nothing but advertising for those books. Needs references; health, temperament, appearance and care sections. --Pharaoh Hound (talk) 19:24, 4 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Last edited at 19:24, 4 January 2007 (UTC). Substituted at 09:17, 29 April 2016 (UTC)

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Puppies are dogs

Since puppies are dogs, then saying "dogs and puppies" is either like saying that puppies aren't dogs—which, of course, they are—or the redundancy of "dogs and dogs." So I propose a rewording from "puppies and dogs" to just "dogs," because "dogs" is inclusive. But my edit was reverted, so I came here to discuss. Thanks. Thayve Sintar (talk) 04:21, 5 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

To an extent you are right, but puppy is a specifier. It means baby dog, while just "dog" implies an adult. It does change the meaning of the sentence because some rescue groups don't handle puppies but give them to foster homes to be raised before being adopted (I think they'd be better off being raised by whoever will have them the rest of their life, but that's a different topic). It's not a huge issue though. White Arabian Filly ^Neigh 23:35, 5 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for your reply, White Arabian Filly. But no, really not correct, because just "dog" implies all ages, because the definition is for the whole species of animal, agelessly. The logic you used would be to imply that puppies are "a different species of animal than a dog," which they obviously are not.

So we could do this in two ways: Just go back to saying "dogs" only, since the contents of this article applies to both baby dogs and the adults, or if editors must still insist, for some odd reason, that the specificity still needs to be there, then let's add the word "adult" just before "dog," as in "puppies and adult dogs." So now that I've cleared that up for you, our next step would be that we agree on one of those two corrections and one of us goes back and remakes the change. Thayve Sintar (talk) 07:18, 12 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

"Puppy" and "dog" are the same in the context of "same species", but represent different life stages of the animal. Puppies and dogs are not the same in the context of any discussion of health, nutrition, behavior, or required care - which is why there are separate words for each life stage. Changes to the meaning of the text should be made only if a cited source supports the change.

Thayve Sintar started this conversation on multiple other pages (for example: Talk:Puppy Bowl, Talk:Boxer (dog)) and has since been blocked from editing (see WP:Sockpuppet investigation). DferDaisy (talk) 18:01, 12 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I like "puppies and adult dogs." BeenAroundAWhile (talk) 21:30, 31 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]